Ep 73: Surviving Pain, Alcohol, and Pills: How Sherry Owings Found Freedom in Kratom

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I took it.
And then we went to Walmart and

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on the way home I was like, you
know, I'm not even hurting.

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I'm not hurting.
And I tell him, I said, you know

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what?
I'm not hurting.

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And he's like, wow, OK, OK, So
when he got home, you know, and

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it got time for me to have that
drink you know, I need.

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Those withdrawals were coming.
It didn't go.

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And I was like, wow, I'm not
gonna have that drink.

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I'm getting emotional and that's
where it started.

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I didn't want that.
Drink no more and it wouldn't

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hurt.
So I'm here with Sherri Owens, a

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super kratom advocate that I
know online.

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Great to finally get to see her
on screen here with Sherri, I,

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you do a lot in the kratom
community as a consumer and

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advocate.
I'm so excited to have you on to

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come Share your story.
So welcome to the podcast.

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Good to be here.
Yeah, I lot of advocating lot of

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it.
Mr. DB has been tough.

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Yeah, we're going to have lots
to talk about.

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This is going to be great.
So first, let's start with you

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telling us a little bit about
yourself and life before kratom.

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OK, so I have scoliasis in the
the top part of my back and so I

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pretty much I don't remember not
having pain.

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You know, I've always had pain,
even as a child started early on

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my mom in the 4th grade, it
started taking me to the

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chiropractor.
So that managed my pain.

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I still go to my chiropractor,
lumbar chiropractor.

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So went out until I turned 18
and had to start factory life,

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got married and that's when my
pain really, really started

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being so bad that we just my
whole the, the neck pain, the

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arm and all, it's just
everything's compressed in

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there.
So I, you know, reached out and

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tried pain meds and stuff and
they made me so sick.

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Any narcotic like that just made
me so sick.

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I could not take it.
So they excuse me instead they

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gave me Flexeril muscle relaxer.
That's when I started and they

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gave me the volume gave me
volume.

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So I did that for years for
about probably, let's see, like

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4 years.
That's what I took from 18 to

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24.
I got pregnant with my daughter

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and I got in a car wreck.
Really messed me up and the car

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went over a bridge and landed on
my side.

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Decided that was bad anyway, but
just smushed it all up in there.

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And after that the pain has just
been horrific.

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So I had to start checking the
pain meds.

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But then they would give me
something like a Finnegan so I

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wouldn't throw the payment up.
But that was my combination.

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They would say I'm gonna fit you
a cocktail was what the doctor

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said.
So I went through pain clinics

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and everything trying to, you
know, get right and they're

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like, it is what it is.
Had to pretty much I couldn't go

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back to my factory job and had
the baby to take care of.

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I couldn't even hold her a
bottle.

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It was just terrible.
But you know, after that they

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just kept adding pills and
adding pills and adding pills.

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And so about when I got off pain
medicine, I was on 26 different

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medications.
And now I don't.

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I don't rarely ever take a pill.
Wow, that's a lot.

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Yeah. 2026.
I was on 26 different

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medications at the end.
That's the end of my journey.

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I know it blew my mind after I
started camping.

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Like, wow, it's just so
emotional to go back and revisit

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all that and actually sit down
and count it up.

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At my first meeting, my first
band meeting because Mississippi

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the year I found kratom, they
decided to ban it Mississippi

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the year after.
So I had to go through all that

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and it was a very emotional
thing to go back.

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And they would argue I was on
and I'm like, how did I even

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function?
You know, I was, I was

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functioning.
So when did you first hear about

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kratom?
How did how did you find out

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about it?
Well, I've been on, you know,

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the, the pain medication journey
for all my life.

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I've been on pretty much.
I was, you know, I was pretty

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sad on the way.
I was on some pretty heavy

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medications at the end I had at
one time I was had I had metric

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and I was no longer taking
those, but this would be my day.

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This would be my day on my pain
medication.

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I had metric and for my real bad
times, I and then I had

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Dorvastat for my just, you know,
casual, not so bad.

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Set up a driving, grabbing a
town.

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I want to grab a garbage that
then I had a Vicoprofen and that

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is it's like a Lortab, but a
Vicoprofen's got ibuprofen in it

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instead of Tylenol.
So I had those.

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Then I had my Valium, then I had
my stomach there's I had way too

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much stuff anyway, and I had my
sleeping pills because of course

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I couldn't sleep after I took so
and then I had my stomach

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medicines because my stomach was
so messed up for all the pills

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and then the the irritable bowel
and it went.

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It was just so much.
It was a pill to fix what that

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other pill broke in me.
I guess that's the that's where

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I was at.
But anyway, and 2011, 2010 my

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husband got real sick.
He was diagnosed with Parkinson.

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He was got real sick and he had
to quit his job.

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Six months later my daddy had a
stroke.

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So I had to take care of both of
them.

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During during the same process.
During these six months is when

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my doctor told me he could no
longer give me my medication,

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that they had cut down and this
is the time I really, really

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need.
I had these two men that I had

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to take care of, my husband and
my father that depended on me.

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So that was a really bad time to
cut my medication.

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They cut my Valium.
I could no longer get my Valium.

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I've been on since I was 1718
years old and I was 50 at that

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time, and they just cut them off
all my pain medications I could.

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With all that I was getting.
I could only get 60 pills now

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for a whole month and I had to
go back every month.

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This was from my doctor, so that
was no way enough.

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It was no way enough.
So I started drinking like just

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wine at night because I had my
daddy living with me and my

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husband and everything they ate,
everything they did had to have

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my help.
So I took my little 60 pain

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pills that month and at night I
would sit down and I would drink

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just to relax and have me time.
And that turned into vodka.

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And I don't know how I made it
through all those years, but I

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did that for eight years or a
little better.

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I had my daddy and my husband in
my house, and I functioned like

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that.
A lot of people didn't even know

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I was drinking.
Later, when I told my husband's

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doctors and stuff, they were
like, wow, I can't even believe

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you were drinking.
Yeah, I was drinking.

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So after that my, my dad did
pass away or not before that,

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but he did end up having more
stroke and I had to put him in a

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nursing home which that was
worse.

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I felt like a failure because I
had to get rid of my daddy.

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And you know, but it was good
for him.

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He he was actually better there.
And my husband started getting

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better.
He had a real bad episode.

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He liked to die, but then he got
better and he, he is the one

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that was looking online and he
found kratom.

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He saw in Alabama, he's an
Alabama man and he saw that they

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were banning kratom up there and
he started reading about it.

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He's baby.
Look at this, this, that, that

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it's just going to help your
pain, you know, because he was,

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I was really struggling trying
to quit drinking.

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You know, I, I, he's getting
better.

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My dad was getting better.
I was struggling to get better.

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I was trying my best to get
better and I'd actually even

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went to rehab when I put my dad
in and my husband was able to,

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you know, actually take care of
his stuff and everything.

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I I went to rehab, you know,
trying to get better.

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But when I got out, alcohol was
still there, my pain was still

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there, blah, blah, blah.
So, you know, I just kept

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sliding back, sliding back.
This was a whole year and it was

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December.
My husband said, I'm going to

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order you this.
I'm gonna argue this, I'm of

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this crate.
I'm like, all right, we'll just

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order it.
You know, whatever, I'll take

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it.
So it came in the day after

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Christmas and I was trying to he
he was helping me because when

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you're drinking, you just can't
quit.

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You could die.
I would go on a binge and he

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would keep some in the house and
hide it for me.

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So when I would do my withdrawal
so bad.

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That was the worst thing about
the, the alcohol with the

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withdrawals.
You could have, you could not

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have a drink and then you could
start having withdrawals decided

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a week or two later, you know,
just the shakes.

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It was just the most I've never
had anything to grab me like

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that and I couldn't get over it.
The anxiety attacks, effort.

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It was just terrible what the
alcohol was doing to me to to

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get past my withdrawal.
He would, you know, have some

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and give me a drink and, you
know, keep it away from me so I

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wouldn't choke it all.
He was really hitting me.

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Anyway, he found my kratom.
So the day after Christmas, it

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came in and I took it.
And then we went to Walmart.

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And on the way home, I was like,
you know, I'm not even hurting.

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I'm not hurting.
And I tell him, I said, you know

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what?
I'm not hurting.

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And he's like, wow, OK, OK.
So when he got home, you know,

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and it got time for me to have
that drink you know, I need,

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those withdrawals were coming.
It didn't go.

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And I was like, wow, I'm not
gonna have that drink.

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I'm getting emotional and that's
where it started.

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I didn't want that drink no more
and it wouldn't hurt.

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That's how it began.
So after that, and I'm still

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scared.
I wouldn't let him away from me,

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you know, I didn't go anywhere
by myself for six months.

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I didn't.
I was just scared.

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But I just kept getting better
and kept getting better and I

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started getting off on more
pills and more pills that the

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other pills.
I was like, wow, if this leaf

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can do this, what what does this
pill do?

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Limit Do some research, you
know, see what this pill does

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and I can find something that we
have that.

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And that's how I got off my
medication.

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I started finding the the leaf
or the tree or whatever or the

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herb and that's what I would
start taking and I'd swing

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myself up over everything.
I was down Effexor, Wellbutrin,

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Prozac at one time, just a lot
of different stuff like that.

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And that was the harder that was
the harder stuff to come off of.

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But I finally we must have off
of all of that.

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That's amazing.
Sherry, how long do you think it

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took you to you fine kratom?
You start using it immediately

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helped you with alcohol and then
over time you're able to wean

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off all the medications.
How long did it take you to wean

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off of those 26 meds?
It was over.

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This was December 2017, December
26th, 2017.

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It's the day I started my crab.
Over the next year I started

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really, you know, waking up my,
my brain started coming back

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more.
So that whole year I went on a

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health kick.
I lost 100 lbs.

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So over the year, the last thing
that I got off of with my

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Wellbutrin, that took a little
longer because it was a little,

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I would cry a little, but it
took me probably six weeks to

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wean off like from 1/2 to 1/4 or
whatever.

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But a year, about a year and
four months, I was totally off

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all the medications, off of
everything.

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I was on gabapentin.
Of course I forgot what all I I

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had a list of all the stuff I
was on but it.

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WAS 26 is a lot.
A lot.

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It was a lot of stuff and.
I don't come across that too

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often where somebody has taken
that many different medications.

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At and I was I was only I was
only 50.

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And so no, I don't, I don't, you
know, I don't take anything.

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I could go, you know, I have an
amazing doctor and I'm I'm not

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going to say everybody doesn't
need their medications.

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My husband, he didn't like
Kratom it, you know, it hurts

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his stomach, so he's not gonna
take it.

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If he needs something, you know,
he takes his medication.

221
00:13:53,000 --> 00:13:56,000
And I have an amazing doctor
that I mean, he really helped me

222
00:13:56,000 --> 00:13:58,880
too with my withdrawal.
I was just straight up and

223
00:13:58,880 --> 00:14:00,960
everybody, that's one thing.
Be straight up.

224
00:14:01,760 --> 00:14:04,240
If that doctor's not going along
with you, there's one out there

225
00:14:04,240 --> 00:14:06,280
that will.
You need a good doctor.

226
00:14:06,280 --> 00:14:08,120
Everybody does that you can talk
to.

227
00:14:08,560 --> 00:14:11,520
And this man had already became
my friend because of what all I

228
00:14:11,520 --> 00:14:14,840
went through with my husband and
he knew my compassion about

229
00:14:14,840 --> 00:14:16,840
everything.
And I was straight up with him.

230
00:14:16,840 --> 00:14:20,840
I'm like, look, I was drinking.
I'm trying to quit help me.

231
00:14:20,840 --> 00:14:22,040
And he did.
He helped me.

232
00:14:22,040 --> 00:14:26,160
He gave me Ivs to keep me out of
the hospital, you know, and, and

233
00:14:26,160 --> 00:14:31,360
he's and now maybe once a year
my pain will get so bad.

234
00:14:31,360 --> 00:14:35,520
I'm I'm garnering and, and I'll
overdo it and everything and

235
00:14:36,080 --> 00:14:39,280
I'll get him all.
And I'm like, doctor, you know,

236
00:14:39,280 --> 00:14:41,960
I need something.
I'm hurting so bad, my, the

237
00:14:42,000 --> 00:14:44,360
herbs aren't getting it.
And he'll write out, mark me a

238
00:14:44,360 --> 00:14:48,000
prescription out right then
because he knows I'm in pain and

239
00:14:48,000 --> 00:14:52,200
he knows I'm not going to act.
And I, he's never said no, you

240
00:14:52,200 --> 00:14:54,880
know, he's never said no.
And he knows, he knows I'm a

241
00:14:54,880 --> 00:14:55,880
pastor.
I told him everything.

242
00:14:55,880 --> 00:14:58,240
I just was straight up.
He's like my husband's like, I

243
00:14:58,240 --> 00:14:59,680
can't believe you tell him all
that.

244
00:14:59,680 --> 00:15:02,800
I'm like, yeah, he's my
psychiatrist too.

245
00:15:05,600 --> 00:15:09,360
That is so important to have a
Doctor Who understands who

246
00:15:09,360 --> 00:15:12,760
listens because you have to
advocate for yourself.

247
00:15:12,760 --> 00:15:16,400
And so many times people tell me
that their doctor gets mad at

248
00:15:16,400 --> 00:15:20,080
them when they tell them they
use kratom and, and they won't

249
00:15:20,080 --> 00:15:23,120
listen to them even though they
try to educate the doctor.

250
00:15:23,320 --> 00:15:26,680
So I'm like you, I I lucked out.
I have a really good primary

251
00:15:26,680 --> 00:15:30,040
care physician.
I told her about kratom from the

252
00:15:30,040 --> 00:15:33,760
start when I started going to
her and she had not heard of it.

253
00:15:33,760 --> 00:15:35,760
But she she wanted to learn
about it.

254
00:15:36,000 --> 00:15:39,280
And I kept every time I'd see
her once or twice a year, I'd

255
00:15:39,280 --> 00:15:42,400
educate her on it.
And over time she could see by

256
00:15:42,400 --> 00:15:46,840
how well I'm doing that.
Like here's a woman who suffers

257
00:15:46,840 --> 00:15:49,000
from debilitating chronic pain
issues.

258
00:15:49,240 --> 00:15:53,200
She has all the, the information
in the my chart app to see like

259
00:15:53,200 --> 00:15:57,000
my history and I come see her
and it's like the only thing I

260
00:15:57,000 --> 00:15:59,120
use as a plant for my chronic
pains.

261
00:15:59,120 --> 00:16:03,040
And, and she just really has
been like so on board with this,

262
00:16:03,040 --> 00:16:05,680
like to the point where she
always tells me, keep doing what

263
00:16:05,680 --> 00:16:09,080
you're doing because it works.
And she just keeps showing more

264
00:16:09,080 --> 00:16:11,120
interest.
I think it's so important to

265
00:16:11,120 --> 00:16:14,560
have a Doctor Who listens and is
on board with us.

266
00:16:14,760 --> 00:16:17,440
And if you, and if the doctor
doesn't, then go find another

267
00:16:17,440 --> 00:16:19,120
doctor.
It's OK to do that.

268
00:16:19,320 --> 00:16:22,400
That's right.
I mean, they work for you.

269
00:16:23,120 --> 00:16:25,280
They work for you.
Yeah.

270
00:16:25,640 --> 00:16:27,440
Aren't you a good doctor?
Because everybody needs a good

271
00:16:27,440 --> 00:16:30,160
doctor.
One, they're going to need a

272
00:16:30,160 --> 00:16:33,200
good doctor.
For sure, and just like what

273
00:16:33,200 --> 00:16:36,440
you're saying, like if I'm
having some really bad muscle

274
00:16:36,440 --> 00:16:39,640
pain, I'll ask her like kind of
get some muscle relaxers.

275
00:16:39,640 --> 00:16:42,440
I mean that was something I took
a lot of back in my pain

276
00:16:42,440 --> 00:16:44,480
management days, but I don't
need them anymore.

277
00:16:44,480 --> 00:16:47,440
I don't need the opiates.
I don't need the gabapentin or

278
00:16:47,680 --> 00:16:50,360
the muscle relaxers.
But sometimes, you know, the

279
00:16:50,360 --> 00:16:52,760
kratom is not helping that part
of my pain.

280
00:16:52,760 --> 00:16:55,640
And she's she's been great.
Like, yeah, because she trusts

281
00:16:55,640 --> 00:16:57,720
me.
She's, you know, and we have a

282
00:16:57,720 --> 00:17:00,200
great relationship.
So it just like with you, it's

283
00:17:00,200 --> 00:17:03,400
great when you have that kind of
patient doctor relationship

284
00:17:03,400 --> 00:17:04,960
where they listen and they help
you.

285
00:17:04,960 --> 00:17:07,839
And it's great to hear that
because I don't always hear

286
00:17:07,839 --> 00:17:09,920
that, you know, interview people
for this podcast.

287
00:17:09,920 --> 00:17:12,800
And some people have given me
horror stories of how their

288
00:17:12,800 --> 00:17:17,200
doctors have treated because.
I would not go back to him or

289
00:17:17,200 --> 00:17:20,160
her, you know.
No, No.

290
00:17:20,960 --> 00:17:22,119
Yeah.
Well, my husband goes to his

291
00:17:22,119 --> 00:17:24,400
doctors because they said a lot
of problems, you know, if we got

292
00:17:24,400 --> 00:17:26,280
better.
We don't believe it was

293
00:17:26,280 --> 00:17:28,560
Parkinson.
I we're pretty sure he was

294
00:17:28,680 --> 00:17:33,080
poisoned from a weed killer.
You know, it didn't guess

295
00:17:33,440 --> 00:17:36,000
because he got better.
He got better, but it took

296
00:17:36,000 --> 00:17:37,960
years.
But I I'll detox.

297
00:17:37,960 --> 00:17:41,640
And he had to get out of his
body and he had neuropathy and

298
00:17:41,640 --> 00:17:43,760
he has nerve trouble and stuff
from it.

299
00:17:44,400 --> 00:17:47,600
But thank God, gave me, gave me
back my husband.

300
00:17:48,080 --> 00:17:50,120
That was terrible.
It was a terrible thing to go

301
00:17:50,120 --> 00:17:56,880
through, you know, and my dad
did end up passing, but he got

302
00:17:56,880 --> 00:17:59,440
to know me sober.
He got to know I was sober.

303
00:17:59,640 --> 00:18:03,760
And that was everything to me
because he was an alcoholic and

304
00:18:03,760 --> 00:18:05,840
he was terrible, you know, don't
drink, don't drink.

305
00:18:05,840 --> 00:18:08,640
That's why I never was a
drinker, you know, And that's

306
00:18:08,640 --> 00:18:12,320
what really blown my mind that
that alcohol got me like that

307
00:18:12,320 --> 00:18:15,800
because I was an occasional, you
know, we go out or something.

308
00:18:15,800 --> 00:18:18,680
I might drink or I was usually
the bartender because I took so

309
00:18:18,680 --> 00:18:21,320
much medication and I didn't
drink, I guess.

310
00:18:21,440 --> 00:18:26,080
And I was the day, day, you
know, You know, I just put in

311
00:18:26,080 --> 00:18:28,280
the drinker and then at 50 it
got me.

312
00:18:30,080 --> 00:18:34,480
I find it so interesting very
that that when you found Kratom,

313
00:18:35,840 --> 00:18:39,560
you were looking for a way to
stop alcohol, but not you

314
00:18:39,560 --> 00:18:42,520
weren't really looking to stop
your pain meds, right?

315
00:18:42,520 --> 00:18:44,920
I mean, you're really just
focused more on the alcohol from

316
00:18:44,920 --> 00:18:49,760
your story you were telling us.
And it's usually the usually I I

317
00:18:49,760 --> 00:18:51,800
love your story because it's so
different.

318
00:18:51,800 --> 00:18:56,040
What I usually hear people say
to me is either, you know,

319
00:18:56,040 --> 00:18:58,960
they're in pain management and
they're get their beds are being

320
00:18:58,960 --> 00:19:03,280
cut back or they're being
dropped or somebody who is just

321
00:19:03,280 --> 00:19:06,560
flat out abusing opiates.
You know, however, they're

322
00:19:06,560 --> 00:19:09,200
getting access to it.
And many times what they'll tell

323
00:19:09,200 --> 00:19:12,840
me is, you know, they found
kratom is it's been amazing for

324
00:19:12,840 --> 00:19:15,520
that.
And then it's like, by the way,

325
00:19:15,680 --> 00:19:17,400
I realize I don't crave alcohol
anymore.

326
00:19:17,400 --> 00:19:21,040
It's like alcohol was the
secondary thing that like this

327
00:19:21,040 --> 00:19:23,280
is amazing.
This plant, I was able to stop

328
00:19:23,280 --> 00:19:25,720
the opiates, but I don't have a
desire to drink anymore.

329
00:19:25,880 --> 00:19:28,720
So it's interesting how yours is
like the other way around.

330
00:19:29,040 --> 00:19:31,080
It's been amazing to help you
stop drinking.

331
00:19:31,080 --> 00:19:34,080
But because it's an amazing
plant, you're like, I don't

332
00:19:34,080 --> 00:19:36,600
think I need all these meds
anymore and able to wean

333
00:19:36,600 --> 00:19:37,560
yourself.
Off.

334
00:19:39,720 --> 00:19:42,480
I've been off pain medication
for a whole year.

335
00:19:43,720 --> 00:19:46,400
I was only drinking.
OK, I gotcha.

336
00:19:46,760 --> 00:19:54,920
January 20, January of 2017, I
went into rehab and I came out.

337
00:19:54,920 --> 00:20:00,800
When I came out, I was on Ativan
because I'd already, you know,

338
00:20:00,800 --> 00:20:03,960
detox from my medication, you
know, got to have even more

339
00:20:03,960 --> 00:20:05,480
medication.
They didn't give me anymore When

340
00:20:05,480 --> 00:20:08,600
I went into rehab.
I detox from everything I call

341
00:20:10,000 --> 00:20:13,360
and medication which all it was
pretty bad but.

342
00:20:14,200 --> 00:20:17,960
When I came out, my doctor
didn't want to see me anymore,

343
00:20:18,960 --> 00:20:22,160
So and I just made my mind up,
I'm going to go to my husband's

344
00:20:22,160 --> 00:20:24,240
doctor.
And when I went to him, I just

345
00:20:24,240 --> 00:20:27,240
told him I'm like, look, I've
been on all this pain

346
00:20:27,240 --> 00:20:28,800
medications.
I don't want to go back down

347
00:20:28,800 --> 00:20:34,400
that road anymore and I don't
want to drink anymore and all

348
00:20:34,400 --> 00:20:36,480
that.
I want you to be my doctor, but

349
00:20:36,480 --> 00:20:38,080
don't never give me no pain
medicine.

350
00:20:38,080 --> 00:20:40,480
I don't want it.
No, I shouldn't have did that.

351
00:20:41,320 --> 00:20:42,760
I.
Don't know.

352
00:20:43,840 --> 00:20:48,000
But so that whole year, you
know, I didn't get any more pain

353
00:20:48,000 --> 00:20:50,280
medicine, but I was drinking
terrible.

354
00:20:50,280 --> 00:20:52,960
I got to really drinking bad
then, you know, because my

355
00:20:52,960 --> 00:20:55,040
husband was better.
I have nobody to take care of.

356
00:20:55,720 --> 00:20:58,920
I was like, I can drink now a
lot and we'll have to worry

357
00:20:58,920 --> 00:21:01,960
about anybody.
So I was, it was really bad.

358
00:21:01,960 --> 00:21:07,840
But yeah, it, it was really bad.
That whole year was a mess and

359
00:21:09,640 --> 00:21:12,800
but my husband stayed with me.
It's like I'm going to get my

360
00:21:12,800 --> 00:21:14,080
wife back.
And he did.

361
00:21:14,080 --> 00:21:18,280
He got me back.
That's wonderful, Sherry.

362
00:21:18,480 --> 00:21:21,760
So how did kratom start
impacting your day-to-day life

363
00:21:21,760 --> 00:21:23,920
and just your overall, overall
well-being?

364
00:21:25,280 --> 00:21:28,480
Well, I can say I was, I was 100
lbs overweight.

365
00:21:29,200 --> 00:21:31,360
It's really bad.
I couldn't do anything.

366
00:21:31,360 --> 00:21:34,040
I have a business also I'm a
locksmith.

367
00:21:34,040 --> 00:21:37,360
I have a locksmith service.
So, and I, I've had that

368
00:21:37,360 --> 00:21:42,920
business for 25 years and I had
people that work for me then and

369
00:21:43,360 --> 00:21:45,920
you know, they couldn't even, I
couldn't even if I get a call

370
00:21:45,920 --> 00:21:48,200
and say you got to go in like
this or God, I couldn't tell

371
00:21:48,200 --> 00:21:51,560
them where to go.
It was just a mess and almost

372
00:21:51,920 --> 00:21:56,320
lost my business, almost lost my
husband did lose my daughter,

373
00:21:56,320 --> 00:22:00,960
still working on that trying to
get her back because I push

374
00:22:00,960 --> 00:22:04,880
everybody away.
I didn't want nobody in my life.

375
00:22:04,880 --> 00:22:09,400
I just wanted my alcohol.
So I, I, I heard a lot of people

376
00:22:09,760 --> 00:22:13,040
because I didn't care.
That stuff makes you not have

377
00:22:13,040 --> 00:22:16,400
any feelings anyway.
Since I got sober, I've been at

378
00:22:16,400 --> 00:22:20,280
every bridge I could and I got
rid of a lot of people in my

379
00:22:20,280 --> 00:22:23,120
life that I didn't want and I
just kept the good and the

380
00:22:23,120 --> 00:22:27,080
positive.
I'm, I garden now it's just me

381
00:22:27,080 --> 00:22:29,440
and my husband.
I've got chickens.

382
00:22:30,040 --> 00:22:33,840
My son is so proud of his Mama.
You know, I've got a good

383
00:22:33,840 --> 00:22:37,880
relationship.
I've got grandkids now and I

384
00:22:37,880 --> 00:22:45,240
advocate a lot of hard work.
We did television, radio, we

385
00:22:45,240 --> 00:22:49,040
just really worked.
And the county bands we've we've

386
00:22:49,040 --> 00:22:51,960
been fighting forever.
These small bands, we've been

387
00:22:51,960 --> 00:22:55,520
able to do all that and I
couldn't have never done all

388
00:22:55,520 --> 00:22:58,360
that without kratom.
I could not get out there today

389
00:22:58,360 --> 00:23:02,160
and work in my garden without
kratom because y'all got to

390
00:23:02,160 --> 00:23:07,080
remember I'll I still have my
pain every day and this leaf

391
00:23:07,560 --> 00:23:12,120
helps me manage my pain.
I'm not all high like I was on

392
00:23:12,120 --> 00:23:16,440
those pain pills that my
stomach's not all messed up like

393
00:23:16,440 --> 00:23:21,080
it was on those pain pills.
I don't get up and have to have

394
00:23:21,080 --> 00:23:24,440
a pain pill with my coffee.
I get up and drink my coffee a

395
00:23:24,560 --> 00:23:27,200
couple hours later when I get I
think about, oh, I hadn't taken

396
00:23:27,200 --> 00:23:29,000
my kratom yet.
I'll take my kratom.

397
00:23:29,800 --> 00:23:35,920
I take mine.
I take mine like every three

398
00:23:35,920 --> 00:23:39,760
hours maybe or or when I start
hurting, I'll say oh, it's time

399
00:23:39,760 --> 00:23:42,120
for my kratom.
But usually after 3:00 I don't

400
00:23:42,120 --> 00:23:44,480
take any kratom.
That's my cut off time.

401
00:23:45,120 --> 00:23:47,840
About the rest of the day I'm
pretty much good.

402
00:23:48,520 --> 00:23:51,120
So I don't I don't I don't
really have a lot of pain and

403
00:23:51,120 --> 00:23:53,520
later in the afternoon if it's
real, real bad, I might take a

404
00:23:53,520 --> 00:23:58,280
quarter of a dose.
I take 2 teaspoons is what I

405
00:23:58,280 --> 00:24:02,680
take out and but I couldn't do
anything.

406
00:24:02,680 --> 00:24:07,280
I know I tell I got a tiller.
I couldn't done anything We did

407
00:24:07,280 --> 00:24:09,040
it yesterday.
I gotta push more.

408
00:24:09,040 --> 00:24:11,800
I couldn't have done anything.
Wow, you know, that's.

409
00:24:11,800 --> 00:24:13,920
Amazing I.
Was 62.

410
00:24:14,360 --> 00:24:16,560
I just rice is my first little
baby chicken.

411
00:24:17,840 --> 00:24:19,600
I love it.
It's amazing.

412
00:24:19,600 --> 00:24:22,320
Like we get our life back, you
know, for those of us who

413
00:24:22,320 --> 00:24:25,280
perform chronic pain, especially
as we're aging, cause everything

414
00:24:25,280 --> 00:24:28,720
just gets harder as we age.
And that's so amazing to hear

415
00:24:28,720 --> 00:24:31,000
'cause when I think back to
being in pain management long

416
00:24:31,000 --> 00:24:35,360
ago when I, when I was younger,
it, I, I just felt so old.

417
00:24:35,360 --> 00:24:37,480
I was, I always felt like
there's a black cloud over me.

418
00:24:37,480 --> 00:24:40,760
Even though the pain meds
helped, it only helps so much.

419
00:24:40,760 --> 00:24:43,640
Like you're still feeling the
pain all the time.

420
00:24:43,640 --> 00:24:46,920
And people did not understand,
people don't understand me

421
00:24:46,920 --> 00:24:48,320
taking these.
You know, I didn't tell very

422
00:24:48,320 --> 00:24:50,960
many people because, you know,
you sit and you say I take

423
00:24:50,960 --> 00:24:53,600
Oxycontin.
Well, you know, people freak out

424
00:24:53,600 --> 00:24:55,640
over that.
But the few, you know, family

425
00:24:55,640 --> 00:24:59,200
members or close friends that I
told, they still didn't

426
00:24:59,200 --> 00:25:01,400
understand.
And I'd be like, this is like if

427
00:25:01,400 --> 00:25:04,720
you took a Tylenol, this is what
Oxycontin would be the quote for

428
00:25:04,720 --> 00:25:06,560
me.
It'd be like, instead of taking

429
00:25:06,560 --> 00:25:09,520
a Tylenol that would help you, I
got to take a whole Oxycontin

430
00:25:09,520 --> 00:25:13,160
that would, you know, knock you
out and I'll get some relief.

431
00:25:13,160 --> 00:25:14,440
I'm not going to get great
relief.

432
00:25:14,520 --> 00:25:18,600
And I really could not do nearly
as much physical activities.

433
00:25:18,680 --> 00:25:22,760
And it, it, it was awful, you
know, and, and having a young

434
00:25:22,760 --> 00:25:27,160
family, it, it, it was no good.
And when I discovered kratom,

435
00:25:27,280 --> 00:25:30,280
it's like, Oh my God, I mean, I
can't do everything, you know,

436
00:25:30,280 --> 00:25:32,160
chronic, like you're saying with
chronic pain.

437
00:25:32,160 --> 00:25:34,120
I mean, I still suffer from
pain.

438
00:25:34,440 --> 00:25:39,280
It's not as bad and I can just
do more.

439
00:25:39,280 --> 00:25:42,800
I can do more and be more
physically active to an extent.

440
00:25:43,040 --> 00:25:46,600
But if I was still in pain
management and being older now,

441
00:25:46,880 --> 00:25:49,400
I, I wouldn't be, I'd probably
be in bed most of the time.

442
00:25:49,520 --> 00:25:53,360
You know, I.
Was in bed when I was taking all

443
00:25:53,360 --> 00:25:56,120
that medicine.
I was in bed most of the time

444
00:25:56,600 --> 00:25:57,800
when I was taking all that
medicine.

445
00:25:58,040 --> 00:26:00,800
I stayed in the bed most time.
I couldn't complete nothing.

446
00:26:00,960 --> 00:26:03,280
I don't know how I was driving
around with all that.

447
00:26:04,120 --> 00:26:11,400
I mean, that was a lot of
medicine, but I've had three

448
00:26:11,400 --> 00:26:14,680
surgery sets.
I've been taking Kratam.

449
00:26:14,680 --> 00:26:20,400
I had I had my elbow and my
wrist at the same time and I was

450
00:26:20,400 --> 00:26:28,440
in a cast for six weeks.
I stopped and I realized now how

451
00:26:31,760 --> 00:26:34,920
people get hooked on the paint
on the medication.

452
00:26:35,120 --> 00:26:37,040
I didn't really see it then
because I had so much.

453
00:26:37,040 --> 00:26:38,920
I never ran out.
I never went and bought a pill

454
00:26:38,920 --> 00:26:41,440
off the off the street because I
had plenty.

455
00:26:41,480 --> 00:26:42,720
I didn't have to.
I didn't.

456
00:26:42,840 --> 00:26:45,000
I had plenty.
It never got out of my system

457
00:26:45,160 --> 00:26:46,960
because they wanted me to keep
it in my system.

458
00:26:47,640 --> 00:26:52,320
So but when the pain, when I
would the pain medication would

459
00:26:52,320 --> 00:26:57,920
run out after my surgery, my
pain would like double.

460
00:26:58,360 --> 00:27:02,360
It would hurt so much worse.
And I would take that pill and

461
00:27:02,360 --> 00:27:05,120
then by the, you know, when that
pain and then that hit me, like

462
00:27:05,440 --> 00:27:09,400
now I understand because when I
run out of craton, my pain is

463
00:27:09,400 --> 00:27:11,800
nothing like when I run out of a
pain pill.

464
00:27:12,240 --> 00:27:15,800
It's just the pain hurts more
when that pain pill is leaving

465
00:27:15,800 --> 00:27:19,800
your body and when the Yeah,
it's different.

466
00:27:20,120 --> 00:27:23,520
And so I, yeah, I quit taking
the pain pills and got right

467
00:27:23,520 --> 00:27:25,080
back on my kratom and I did so
good.

468
00:27:25,280 --> 00:27:30,160
These three surgeries, I, I
recovered so much well, better

469
00:27:30,160 --> 00:27:32,920
than any of my other surgeries
that I had.

470
00:27:33,360 --> 00:27:37,160
I I pop right back up.
I'm doing and I'm just, it's

471
00:27:37,160 --> 00:27:38,600
crazy.
Yeah.

472
00:27:39,600 --> 00:27:42,400
That's amazing.
Yeah, and my husband hunt that I

473
00:27:42,400 --> 00:27:43,880
can drag.
I drag all the deer out of the

474
00:27:43,880 --> 00:27:45,400
woods.
Yeah, Oh my gosh.

475
00:27:46,280 --> 00:27:48,120
That's wild, Jerry.
Oh my gosh.

476
00:27:48,520 --> 00:27:50,280
Yeah, we always get them and
stuff and all that.

477
00:27:50,640 --> 00:27:52,960
Just me.
And my husband, wow, that's,

478
00:27:53,040 --> 00:27:55,600
that's amazing.
Just to know that a leaf from a

479
00:27:55,600 --> 00:27:59,960
tree allows you to do all that
instead of a pharmaceutical from

480
00:27:59,960 --> 00:28:02,680
a lab.
And am I able to, I can, yeah.

481
00:28:02,760 --> 00:28:06,920
No, I, I can unlock, you know,
we unlock cars and houses and I

482
00:28:06,920 --> 00:28:09,960
can go do all that.
I jump up on semis and unlock

483
00:28:09,960 --> 00:28:12,960
them and yeah, they're like,
wow, you're the one doing that.

484
00:28:13,320 --> 00:28:15,640
Yeah, look at that.
That's amazing.

485
00:28:15,640 --> 00:28:18,240
And I'm not knocking the
pharmaceuticals because it

486
00:28:18,240 --> 00:28:22,040
helped me when I needed them and
helps lots of people today and

487
00:28:22,640 --> 00:28:26,440
ABS 100 percent, 100%.
And I hate how we as pain

488
00:28:26,440 --> 00:28:29,720
patients got wrapped up in the
opioid crisis and they never

489
00:28:29,720 --> 00:28:32,520
should have involved us the way
they did with all these

490
00:28:32,520 --> 00:28:35,560
government policies and scaring
the doctors and putting some in

491
00:28:35,560 --> 00:28:39,560
prison, which was a joke.
And unless, and that's how I

492
00:28:39,560 --> 00:28:41,080
lost access.
You know, I was in pain

493
00:28:41,080 --> 00:28:43,920
management for nine years, never
had any problems, followed all

494
00:28:43,920 --> 00:28:45,920
the rules.
The doctor, I me and the doctor

495
00:28:45,920 --> 00:28:50,760
had a great relationship, but he
got scared off because of all

496
00:28:50,760 --> 00:28:53,000
those.
And he was young too, so I'm

497
00:28:53,000 --> 00:28:54,800
sure he was worried about his
future.

498
00:28:54,800 --> 00:28:56,920
So, you know, he sends out a
form letter to all of his

499
00:28:56,920 --> 00:28:59,920
patients that he's no longer
going to prescribe the meds.

500
00:28:59,920 --> 00:29:03,600
It's kind of like a little CEA
letter, Dear John letter and

501
00:29:03,920 --> 00:29:06,040
with a list of other doctors to
call.

502
00:29:06,080 --> 00:29:10,320
And no, no doctor would take
over because when they hear how,

503
00:29:10,320 --> 00:29:13,560
what, when you're on high MME,
the, the, what they call it the

504
00:29:13,560 --> 00:29:18,320
milligram morphine equivalent.
I, I, I'm a super fast

505
00:29:18,320 --> 00:29:19,520
processor.
Like with the meds.

506
00:29:19,520 --> 00:29:23,760
I, I've even had a
pharmacokinetic test done.

507
00:29:23,760 --> 00:29:26,360
My doctor was smart enough to do
that, but I think that was to

508
00:29:26,360 --> 00:29:30,320
protect him because I was, it
took high doses of opiates for

509
00:29:30,320 --> 00:29:33,480
it to even touch my pain.
And it just turned out when they

510
00:29:33,480 --> 00:29:37,480
did a pharmacokinetic test, it
just showed that with my DNA,

511
00:29:37,520 --> 00:29:39,800
I'm going to process those very
quickly.

512
00:29:39,800 --> 00:29:43,240
So that's why I need high doses
and why I need it more often.

513
00:29:43,720 --> 00:29:47,440
And when I'm calling all these
doctors and trying to find

514
00:29:47,440 --> 00:29:51,640
somebody to take over, I mean,
they would be like, we don't

515
00:29:51,640 --> 00:29:53,520
even prescribe a 10th of what
you take.

516
00:29:53,520 --> 00:29:57,200
So we can't help you, you know,
or we don't prescribe anymore

517
00:29:57,360 --> 00:29:59,840
either.
And it was like nobody wants to

518
00:29:59,840 --> 00:30:01,760
prescribe anymore.
They've all been scared off.

519
00:30:01,760 --> 00:30:04,200
And what do they expect those
pain patients to do?

520
00:30:04,200 --> 00:30:08,440
Like I said before I come crate
them, I really thought I'd have

521
00:30:08,440 --> 00:30:12,960
to go to the streets to go buy
the meds that helped me.

522
00:30:13,160 --> 00:30:15,240
But I'm buying it on the black
market and you don't even know

523
00:30:15,240 --> 00:30:16,880
if fentanyl is in it.
So you don't know if it's going

524
00:30:16,880 --> 00:30:20,400
to kill you even though it even
though it just looks like it.

525
00:30:20,840 --> 00:30:23,800
And I was scared.
I didn't even know how to go buy

526
00:30:23,800 --> 00:30:25,240
them.
Anyway, I'm asking around.

527
00:30:25,240 --> 00:30:26,600
Like I seriously started asking
around.

528
00:30:26,600 --> 00:30:27,920
Like how do I find a drug
dealer?

529
00:30:28,400 --> 00:30:31,760
And thank God I found kratom
during all that because I didn't

530
00:30:31,760 --> 00:30:36,320
have to go down that road.
But I don't think the medical

531
00:30:36,320 --> 00:30:39,280
establishment understands what
they do to us chronic pain

532
00:30:39,280 --> 00:30:41,880
patients.
Like, like, I'm sure with

533
00:30:41,880 --> 00:30:44,640
yourself, just like me, we know
we have to take something for

534
00:30:44,640 --> 00:30:47,600
the rest of our lives, like,
like to not suffer, to not be

535
00:30:47,600 --> 00:30:51,120
suffering every day.
And, and I'm OK with that.

536
00:30:51,120 --> 00:30:54,480
I understood this very clearly
going into pain management, but

537
00:30:54,920 --> 00:30:58,440
to, to lose access and nobody
will take over is a scary thing

538
00:30:58,440 --> 00:31:00,440
to go through.
That's one of the reasons why

539
00:31:00,440 --> 00:31:03,960
I'm a big creative advocate.
Is it what fuels me to advocate

540
00:31:03,960 --> 00:31:06,000
because I don't want somebody to
go through what I did.

541
00:31:06,000 --> 00:31:08,520
Being dropped from pain
management thinking you got to

542
00:31:08,520 --> 00:31:11,560
go to the streets and and that's
a scary prospect.

543
00:31:11,720 --> 00:31:15,760
And who knew a little plant
could do so much.

544
00:31:15,760 --> 00:31:18,480
And for me better.
It works way better for me.

545
00:31:18,480 --> 00:31:22,000
Like I, I got decent pain
relief, like not great pain

546
00:31:22,000 --> 00:31:23,440
relief.
I got, you know, enough where I

547
00:31:23,440 --> 00:31:25,120
could still work and and do
things.

548
00:31:25,120 --> 00:31:27,520
I wasn't always happy and I was
always suffering and pain.

549
00:31:27,920 --> 00:31:32,000
But with kratom, it's like
sometimes I literally forget

550
00:31:32,000 --> 00:31:36,120
that I suffer from pain, like
because I it goes away

551
00:31:36,120 --> 00:31:37,800
completely.
Like right now my back doesn't

552
00:31:37,800 --> 00:31:39,960
hurt at all and I just feel
great.

553
00:31:39,960 --> 00:31:41,920
Now it's going to wear off and
I'm going to go need to take

554
00:31:41,920 --> 00:31:44,600
another dose.
But it's just amazing that a

555
00:31:44,600 --> 00:31:47,920
plant works this much better for
me than the pharmaceuticals ever

556
00:31:47,920 --> 00:31:51,960
did.
Right It's crazy and you know,

557
00:31:51,960 --> 00:31:54,760
if I hadn't had that
relationship with that doctor

558
00:31:54,760 --> 00:31:58,080
already, you know, with my
husband because it was my

559
00:31:58,080 --> 00:32:01,480
husband's doctor, I would have
never found another doctor that

560
00:32:01,480 --> 00:32:05,000
would just give me a pain
medicine when I absolutely have

561
00:32:05,000 --> 00:32:11,160
to have one, you know, but it's
really hard but anyway,

562
00:32:11,160 --> 00:32:13,800
everybody days to get out there
and advocate for you for your

563
00:32:13,800 --> 00:32:16,360
stuff.
You're going to lose it so

564
00:32:16,360 --> 00:32:17,480
because.
It's so important.

565
00:32:17,680 --> 00:32:22,840
Yeah, my, my county was banned.
We were the second county in

566
00:32:22,840 --> 00:32:25,600
Mississippi to ban for a whole
year.

567
00:32:26,880 --> 00:32:29,600
My county was banned.
The sheriff live right across

568
00:32:29,600 --> 00:32:31,320
the road from me that got it
banned.

569
00:32:32,040 --> 00:32:35,160
I was terrified.
Yeah, so and I and they put me

570
00:32:35,160 --> 00:32:38,200
on the.
So anyway, the first county to

571
00:32:38,200 --> 00:32:42,560
ban was Lanes County.
That's where all the stuff

572
00:32:42,560 --> 00:32:46,480
started in Mississippi.
So I went over there and of all

573
00:32:46,480 --> 00:32:48,880
people to put on the front page,
it was me.

574
00:32:49,400 --> 00:32:53,160
They put me on the front page
and my name and everything.

575
00:32:53,160 --> 00:32:58,160
And so then the very next day I
saw my sheriff, my next door

576
00:32:58,160 --> 00:33:01,840
neighbor on TV said we're going
to ban this bad stuff, blah,

577
00:33:01,840 --> 00:33:03,480
blah, blah.
You know, he was just standing

578
00:33:03,480 --> 00:33:07,920
there and here I am on the front
engineer and they banned it.

579
00:33:08,520 --> 00:33:12,040
Our county banned that week
before we, I, we didn't even

580
00:33:12,040 --> 00:33:13,480
know it was going to be a
meeting or anything.

581
00:33:13,480 --> 00:33:17,760
They just banned it.
So here I am illegal, terrified

582
00:33:18,600 --> 00:33:21,200
because the sheriff knows now
that I take kratom.

583
00:33:21,320 --> 00:33:23,400
And yeah, I was just, it was
terrible.

584
00:33:23,400 --> 00:33:26,440
It was terrifying.
And then I had a girl find me

585
00:33:26,440 --> 00:33:28,880
and reached out to me and it's
like, you've got to help.

586
00:33:28,880 --> 00:33:34,800
And I'm like, no, I'm not even
they, my county paper wanted me

587
00:33:34,800 --> 00:33:40,000
to do a, a interview and I'm
like, no, I live across Redmond

588
00:33:40,000 --> 00:33:42,600
Sheriff, I'm illegal right now.
I'm not doing it.

589
00:33:42,680 --> 00:33:44,320
I'm not bringing the more
attention to me.

590
00:33:45,000 --> 00:33:47,880
But then I got mad and I'm like,
I'm bringing attention to me.

591
00:33:47,880 --> 00:33:50,920
I'm not going to let that man
over there scare me.

592
00:33:51,040 --> 00:33:53,240
We're going, we're going, I'm
getting my rights back.

593
00:33:53,240 --> 00:33:56,360
So we, we thought we got a new
sheriff too.

594
00:33:56,360 --> 00:33:58,560
He got fired.
We got a new sheriff.

595
00:33:58,560 --> 00:34:02,840
And that sheriff, he actually
went to the meeting with us and

596
00:34:02,840 --> 00:34:07,040
he told them he'd rather have me
driving around Kratom and drive

597
00:34:07,040 --> 00:34:10,080
around drinking.
It's before Oh.

598
00:34:11,000 --> 00:34:14,239
My gosh, that's great.
Yeah.

599
00:34:14,960 --> 00:34:17,840
So when this ban was this more
than just the sale like this is

600
00:34:17,840 --> 00:34:19,440
to criminalize it?
Yeah, yeah.

601
00:34:20,199 --> 00:34:23,920
You couldn't sell it if if I'd
have got caught, but I couldn't

602
00:34:23,920 --> 00:34:27,440
even get it delivered to my home
because when your county is

603
00:34:27,440 --> 00:34:31,040
banned, the credit card
processors won't process it or

604
00:34:31,040 --> 00:34:33,679
anything.
You know, I can't go to I can't

605
00:34:33,840 --> 00:34:36,320
go to Amory.
So we jumped on it right then we

606
00:34:36,320 --> 00:34:40,920
got a little advocacy group.
We jumped on it and we got all

607
00:34:40,920 --> 00:34:43,120
these cities and towns.
We started going with it.

608
00:34:43,120 --> 00:34:45,560
Our town didn't get banned.
I could go to town and buy it

609
00:34:46,120 --> 00:34:48,239
and bring it back to my house,
but I was illegal.

610
00:34:49,080 --> 00:34:53,000
So yeah, make that make sense.
But anyway, it took us a year.

611
00:34:53,000 --> 00:34:55,719
It took us a whole year to get
it done banned, but we did.

612
00:34:55,719 --> 00:34:59,880
But we just started going to
all, every group every and we

613
00:34:59,960 --> 00:35:02,160
and we stopped a lot.
We stopped it a lot.

614
00:35:02,160 --> 00:35:04,800
And sometimes we think that's
listen to us and they we leave

615
00:35:04,800 --> 00:35:06,960
and they'd ban it.
It was like, Dang it.

616
00:35:09,240 --> 00:35:12,880
I'm so glad you're advocating
because we need more people

617
00:35:12,880 --> 00:35:15,480
advocating.
We need more fellow consumers to

618
00:35:15,480 --> 00:35:18,560
speak up and speak out.
I know some people say, look, I

619
00:35:18,560 --> 00:35:22,000
can't because of my job or
because of whatever, which I

620
00:35:22,040 --> 00:35:23,680
understand.
But there's a lot you can do

621
00:35:23,680 --> 00:35:26,040
anonymously.
You can e-mail, you can call.

622
00:35:26,040 --> 00:35:29,600
You don't have to go in person.
You don't have to say who you

623
00:35:29,600 --> 00:35:33,040
are.
But it is better if you show

624
00:35:33,040 --> 00:35:36,920
yourself as a constituent
because they're there to serve

625
00:35:36,920 --> 00:35:39,600
you.
They're they work for you and so

626
00:35:39,600 --> 00:35:42,880
our voices need to be heard,
otherwise they will take it

627
00:35:42,880 --> 00:35:44,560
away.
So it's great that you got

628
00:35:44,560 --> 00:35:47,400
people together to advocate.
That's awesome.

629
00:35:47,680 --> 00:35:53,480
Yeah, well, it took me being in
the paper and a lady that her

630
00:35:53,480 --> 00:35:58,560
husband actually got off a
heroin and she was advocating

631
00:35:58,560 --> 00:36:01,080
for him.
He owns its own business now in

632
00:36:01,080 --> 00:36:04,360
town and doing fantastic.
So she found me.

633
00:36:04,360 --> 00:36:07,200
She's we've got to do something
because he needs this.

634
00:36:07,200 --> 00:36:08,400
And I'm like, let's do
something.

635
00:36:08,680 --> 00:36:11,000
So we'd started jumping in and
going to meetings, you know,

636
00:36:11,040 --> 00:36:12,120
we'd just show up.
Hey.

637
00:36:14,120 --> 00:36:16,720
I love that now when did when
did the band start?

638
00:36:16,720 --> 00:36:17,840
What?
What year was that?

639
00:36:17,840 --> 00:36:22,920
When it first. 2018.
OK, 2018.

640
00:36:23,400 --> 00:36:31,640
No 2019 20/19/2019 OK 2019
February 2019 Yep.

641
00:36:32,440 --> 00:36:37,040
And then Mississippi started
banning it and we had our start

642
00:36:37,040 --> 00:36:39,080
going to the capital.
We started going to capital.

643
00:36:39,080 --> 00:36:42,920
A group of us started going to
capital and we just thought we

644
00:36:42,920 --> 00:36:44,400
just was grabbing them in the
hallway.

645
00:36:44,400 --> 00:36:45,960
So hey, you need to listen to
us.

646
00:36:46,440 --> 00:36:48,360
Or he's making a meetings unit
because they don't want to talk

647
00:36:48,360 --> 00:36:49,920
to you.
They don't want to talk to you.

648
00:36:49,920 --> 00:36:52,720
But they did.
They would, some would listen,

649
00:36:52,720 --> 00:36:56,080
some had their minds made-up.
And then every year, you know,

650
00:36:56,280 --> 00:36:57,880
some would leave and some would
go.

651
00:36:57,880 --> 00:37:00,080
You got to do it every year.
You got to go back and grab the

652
00:37:00,080 --> 00:37:03,000
one that's not.
You can't just sit around and

653
00:37:03,000 --> 00:37:05,680
not wait and and don't wait on
somebody else.

654
00:37:05,680 --> 00:37:09,520
Don't mate on AKA they're busy.
They've helped us, but when

655
00:37:09,520 --> 00:37:12,840
they're not there, you got to
still got you can't 100% wait.

656
00:37:12,840 --> 00:37:15,600
You got to get up there because
you're fighting for yourself.

657
00:37:16,080 --> 00:37:22,720
And I and I would tell everybody
like our I don't know if Texas

658
00:37:22,720 --> 00:37:26,840
did that or not, like the
counties and towns banned.

659
00:37:27,360 --> 00:37:31,480
Like you could go ride to like
some of my surrounding towns are

660
00:37:31,480 --> 00:37:33,640
banned.
If I go over there and get

661
00:37:33,640 --> 00:37:37,480
caught with it, I'm a criminal.
And I wish they would lift all

662
00:37:37,480 --> 00:37:40,400
that, but I don't know.
It's you never know what town

663
00:37:40,400 --> 00:37:43,960
you're going to go to that's
that's banned and not.

664
00:37:43,960 --> 00:37:46,520
It's just it's the wildest
thing.

665
00:37:46,520 --> 00:37:49,080
It's like, wow, always.
Yeah.

666
00:37:49,320 --> 00:37:53,600
I don't know if anybody actually
had forgotten a fine for having

667
00:37:53,600 --> 00:37:56,160
kratom.
Pretty much they just didn't the

668
00:37:56,160 --> 00:37:59,400
sales.
Yeah, I mean, I haven't heard of

669
00:37:59,480 --> 00:38:03,600
anything like that in in
Mississippi, but but it's hard

670
00:38:03,600 --> 00:38:07,440
to get the information to like
like, you know, to know, like it

671
00:38:07,440 --> 00:38:11,240
did somebody get locked up?
It's it's not going to always be

672
00:38:11,320 --> 00:38:14,360
easily accessible to get that
information because, you know,

673
00:38:14,360 --> 00:38:16,240
used to be get a lot of that on
Facebook.

674
00:38:16,240 --> 00:38:18,840
But Facebook doesn't let you
type the word kratom.

675
00:38:18,840 --> 00:38:20,240
I think they just lived with
them.

676
00:38:20,280 --> 00:38:22,680
I think.
I think we can finally type the

677
00:38:22,680 --> 00:38:25,040
word kratom.
I know for a good while if you

678
00:38:25,040 --> 00:38:29,000
typed it in it, it wouldn't take
you to anything because they

679
00:38:29,000 --> 00:38:32,720
basically censored the entire
word and removed a bunch of

680
00:38:32,720 --> 00:38:35,520
Facebook groups and they took
down my Creme Stories podcast

681
00:38:35,680 --> 00:38:38,320
Facebook page and they took down
a bunch of groups.

682
00:38:39,520 --> 00:38:42,640
So it makes it harder to
advocate because we're not

683
00:38:42,640 --> 00:38:44,280
always getting all the
information.

684
00:38:44,800 --> 00:38:50,000
Yeah, it's hard.
And people get tired with all so

685
00:38:50,000 --> 00:38:53,560
many of that's just burnout.
I mean, we're fighting the same

686
00:38:53,560 --> 00:38:56,520
bite over and over and over.
Like like I said, there's deep,

687
00:38:56,640 --> 00:38:59,040
deep faces every year.
You got to go back every year

688
00:38:59,040 --> 00:39:03,080
because, yeah, you know, or, or
somebody's mom was gonna come to

689
00:39:03,160 --> 00:39:08,200
some stuff and you got to go
tighten up that, you know, like

690
00:39:10,160 --> 00:39:12,840
something.
Something it's important to be

691
00:39:12,840 --> 00:39:15,200
proactive with it like what
you're talking about doing

692
00:39:15,200 --> 00:39:19,080
because looking, look at
Louisiana, So Louisiana there's

693
00:39:19,080 --> 00:39:22,000
they said, they say there's like
300,000 kratom consumers.

694
00:39:22,000 --> 00:39:25,120
That's how a lot of people, but
not enough of them were showing

695
00:39:25,120 --> 00:39:28,160
up to any of the hearings.
And we were watching a lot of

696
00:39:28,160 --> 00:39:31,160
them live on the kratom gals.
And we already saw that those

697
00:39:31,160 --> 00:39:33,600
legislators in Louisiana, it
looked like they'd already

698
00:39:33,600 --> 00:39:35,840
made-up their mind for quite
some time of what they were

699
00:39:35,840 --> 00:39:38,960
going to do.
But you still can't beat the

700
00:39:38,960 --> 00:39:42,480
impact of having consumers show
up and, and speak their voice

701
00:39:42,520 --> 00:39:46,840
because they have to listen.
Even even if they don't want to

702
00:39:46,840 --> 00:39:50,480
do what you want, they still it
when you that presence, an

703
00:39:50,480 --> 00:39:52,360
overwhelming presence does make
a difference.

704
00:39:52,360 --> 00:39:55,160
But we just weren't getting
enough people showing up in

705
00:39:55,160 --> 00:39:57,280
Louisiana.
And I think what happens is

706
00:39:57,520 --> 00:39:59,440
people don't know until it's too
late.

707
00:39:59,440 --> 00:40:03,960
So now you know, August 1st has
come and gone and I I'm sure

708
00:40:03,960 --> 00:40:08,240
they're probably 10s of
thousands, maybe more, way more

709
00:40:08,240 --> 00:40:11,600
because they say there's 300,000
consumers that probably have no

710
00:40:11,600 --> 00:40:15,440
idea is now not just banned but
criminalized where they could go

711
00:40:15,440 --> 00:40:19,640
to prison.
And the next time they go their

712
00:40:19,640 --> 00:40:22,840
visit their smoke shop or go buy
online, they're in for a rude

713
00:40:22,840 --> 00:40:26,680
awakening, not knowing that this
has already happened and there's

714
00:40:26,680 --> 00:40:28,080
nothing they can do at the
moment.

715
00:40:28,080 --> 00:40:29,720
I mean, they could could go make
some calls.

716
00:40:29,880 --> 00:40:31,520
It won't change anything right
now.

717
00:40:31,720 --> 00:40:35,320
But they're going to have to get
out there and advocate a lot to

718
00:40:35,320 --> 00:40:37,600
help undo this.
And we know it can be undone

719
00:40:37,600 --> 00:40:39,920
because look at Rhode Island.
Rhode Island just got reversed.

720
00:40:40,240 --> 00:40:43,240
They've had a ban for years.
It got reversed is doable.

721
00:40:43,720 --> 00:40:48,360
But you know, I think too many
times consumers think, oh,

722
00:40:48,360 --> 00:40:50,280
nothing's happening here, so I'm
safe.

723
00:40:50,280 --> 00:40:52,920
And I thought that for a while
being in Texas, because we have

724
00:40:52,920 --> 00:40:55,920
a KCPA, we have a consumer
protect, a kratom Consumer

725
00:40:55,920 --> 00:40:58,200
Protection Act.
And you think, oh, well, they've

726
00:40:58,200 --> 00:41:01,160
got regulations here in my
state, so I'm safe.

727
00:41:01,200 --> 00:41:03,920
A lot of us thought that.
And then what happens earlier

728
00:41:03,920 --> 00:41:08,960
this year, they brought a kratom
bill to to ban and criminalize

729
00:41:08,960 --> 00:41:11,680
just like Louisiana.
And we're like many of us

730
00:41:12,320 --> 00:41:14,360
consumers and advocates were
like, wait a minute, but we have

731
00:41:14,360 --> 00:41:15,960
a KCPA.
What's going on?

732
00:41:16,200 --> 00:41:19,400
So they tried really hard.
Luckily it did not, you know, it

733
00:41:19,400 --> 00:41:21,960
got through the Senate.
It stopped at the House and died

734
00:41:22,000 --> 00:41:26,560
in in committee, Thank God, But
it's been a wake up call to a

735
00:41:26,560 --> 00:41:28,680
lot of us in Texas.
So I I like you.

736
00:41:28,720 --> 00:41:31,640
I've assembled people.
I have like a whole e-mail list

737
00:41:31,640 --> 00:41:33,840
of all of us Texas kratom
consumers.

738
00:41:34,240 --> 00:41:38,160
And now we're like, OK, we got
to be proactive.

739
00:41:38,400 --> 00:41:42,600
Our our in Texas.
They they do every two years.

740
00:41:42,600 --> 00:41:45,280
We got two years until it starts
back up again where they will

741
00:41:45,280 --> 00:41:50,360
probably try to reintroduce it.
So me and others in the

742
00:41:50,360 --> 00:41:55,120
community are like, OK, we got
two years to go to Austin and go

743
00:41:55,120 --> 00:41:57,400
knock on those doors and talk to
people.

744
00:41:57,840 --> 00:42:00,480
Every hour.
We, we have to do it.

745
00:42:00,720 --> 00:42:04,440
And I was in Washington, DC
earlier this year with AKA and

746
00:42:04,440 --> 00:42:09,080
other kratom advocates and
kratom industry people doing

747
00:42:09,080 --> 00:42:10,640
just that, you know, on Capitol
Hill.

748
00:42:10,640 --> 00:42:13,880
I've done it twice now.
I've been there to go talk to

749
00:42:13,880 --> 00:42:17,520
legislators and staff and it
makes such a difference.

750
00:42:17,520 --> 00:42:19,840
And especially when they hear
from somebody like me that

751
00:42:20,120 --> 00:42:23,440
suffered from chronic pain and
be able to share my story and

752
00:42:23,440 --> 00:42:28,120
tell them about how I went from
9 years of daily opiates to a

753
00:42:28,120 --> 00:42:30,440
plant and then pulling out my
Kratom bag.

754
00:42:30,440 --> 00:42:31,440
You know, I'd have it in my
backpack.

755
00:42:31,760 --> 00:42:35,440
This is what I, and every time
they look and go, I'd open it

756
00:42:35,440 --> 00:42:37,080
up.
I said, this is what I take.

757
00:42:37,240 --> 00:42:40,280
It's just a powder.
I, I drink a tea and every time

758
00:42:40,280 --> 00:42:43,440
they go like, that's it.
It looks like macho like, you

759
00:42:43,440 --> 00:42:46,360
know, we're educating these
people, but we have to be

760
00:42:46,360 --> 00:42:50,040
proactive and not wait because
otherwise it'll be like

761
00:42:50,040 --> 00:42:51,800
Louisiana.
One day you're going to wake up

762
00:42:51,800 --> 00:42:54,280
and and you have no access and
you'll you'll be a criminal and

763
00:42:54,280 --> 00:42:58,240
go to prison.
Like, I mean, this year it is

764
00:42:58,240 --> 00:43:02,160
everybody we talked to like,
wow, I've never heard this, this

765
00:43:02,160 --> 00:43:04,120
side of it.
I've just heard the bad stuff.

766
00:43:04,680 --> 00:43:07,240
You know, you take it, you take
it.

767
00:43:07,320 --> 00:43:09,560
You know, all of us were
different, all different ages.

768
00:43:09,560 --> 00:43:14,280
We took it for different things.
One lady takes it for seizures,

769
00:43:15,200 --> 00:43:18,280
but she didn't have seizures
anymore because she takes it.

770
00:43:18,280 --> 00:43:22,400
And she was having them like two
or three a day and now they're

771
00:43:22,400 --> 00:43:25,320
gone.
So yeah, it's crazy.

772
00:43:25,920 --> 00:43:28,040
But yeah, we have lunch with
them.

773
00:43:28,040 --> 00:43:31,080
It's they're just people.
They're all people.

774
00:43:31,600 --> 00:43:32,960
Everybody's dared to talk to
him.

775
00:43:32,960 --> 00:43:34,400
If you don't talk to him,
they're going to take your

776
00:43:34,400 --> 00:43:37,440
rights away.
I've just. 100%.

777
00:43:37,640 --> 00:43:41,240
Though advocating through this,
my eyes is really opened up to

778
00:43:41,280 --> 00:43:44,360
how crooked our government is
now.

779
00:43:44,360 --> 00:43:47,120
I'm just saying it and you
better keep your eyes open there

780
00:43:47,120 --> 00:43:50,360
because they will take your
right of any way they can

781
00:43:50,560 --> 00:43:52,240
because they get paid to take
your rights.

782
00:43:53,120 --> 00:43:56,720
Yes, we're not we're we're
fighting for all right.

783
00:43:56,840 --> 00:44:01,920
Why Big Farm is there in their
pockets the whole time and I

784
00:44:01,920 --> 00:44:06,400
have seen so much and just, you
know, no more matter how much

785
00:44:06,400 --> 00:44:09,640
science we put out there, Big
Farm, it's putting out the book.

786
00:44:09,760 --> 00:44:14,360
So you just, you know, you got
to keep you got to let them know

787
00:44:14,360 --> 00:44:18,640
that you're oh, votes them in
and votes them out.

788
00:44:18,640 --> 00:44:21,480
They might get a payday, but
they might not be there next

789
00:44:21,480 --> 00:44:22,600
year for getting a payday
because.

790
00:44:22,600 --> 00:44:26,480
You exactly, exactly.
And our voices matter.

791
00:44:26,480 --> 00:44:28,480
Our voices.
So many times people think their

792
00:44:28,480 --> 00:44:30,040
voice doesn't matter.
It does matter.

793
00:44:30,080 --> 00:44:32,760
Every voice matters.
It makes a difference when you

794
00:44:32,760 --> 00:44:37,680
call your senator and your house
reps and and even call locally

795
00:44:37,680 --> 00:44:39,200
to your City Council and the
mayor.

796
00:44:39,560 --> 00:44:42,360
Every good helps to hear our
personal story.

797
00:44:42,360 --> 00:44:44,560
That's why I do this podcast.
I want people to come on and

798
00:44:44,560 --> 00:44:48,040
share their personal story of
how kratom has helped them and

799
00:44:48,040 --> 00:44:51,600
is so incredibly powerful.
And so we just, we need more

800
00:44:51,600 --> 00:44:53,880
people doing this.
We need more podcasts like this.

801
00:44:54,040 --> 00:44:56,440
I you need to be like a whole
bunch of kratom stories,

802
00:44:56,440 --> 00:44:59,720
podcasts, you know, we, we need
more stories out there for

803
00:44:59,720 --> 00:45:02,640
people to hear because what
we're doing is normalizing the

804
00:45:02,640 --> 00:45:05,960
plant.
Right, right, right.

805
00:45:06,320 --> 00:45:10,520
God gave us everything we need.
I mean, every, every pail that's

806
00:45:10,600 --> 00:45:13,640
made it, it came from a plant,
just about everything.

807
00:45:14,240 --> 00:45:16,600
Exactly.
I turned it into a.

808
00:45:16,840 --> 00:45:19,400
Chemical, right, right.
I take the plant turned to a

809
00:45:19,400 --> 00:45:21,040
chemical.
But, you know, we want to just

810
00:45:21,040 --> 00:45:24,080
consume the natural plant as
it's intended to be.

811
00:45:24,080 --> 00:45:27,400
And as Doctor McCurdy says, it's
a Symphony with all the

812
00:45:27,400 --> 00:45:29,080
alkaloids.
And it's so true.

813
00:45:29,440 --> 00:45:33,600
The the wing, it just works
together to help you with pain,

814
00:45:33,600 --> 00:45:36,400
with some energy, with so many
things.

815
00:45:36,400 --> 00:45:39,080
You know, it's just an amazing
plant.

816
00:45:40,560 --> 00:45:42,800
Look, let's talk about 70 H.
That's been like a it's

817
00:45:42,840 --> 00:45:44,840
interesting.
I've had this pie cast for a few

818
00:45:44,840 --> 00:45:49,000
years and it seems like now more
than ever we're we're hearing

819
00:45:49,000 --> 00:45:51,080
about 7.
OH constantly people are

820
00:45:51,080 --> 00:45:54,080
confused.
They think is is strong kratom.

821
00:45:54,400 --> 00:45:55,840
A lot of people have been
misled.

822
00:45:55,840 --> 00:45:57,960
I'm going to be perfectly clear
at the start of this.

823
00:45:58,160 --> 00:46:00,760
I'm not for prohibition.
I don't think it should be

824
00:46:00,760 --> 00:46:02,560
schedule one.
I just think it needs to be

825
00:46:02,560 --> 00:46:05,760
regulated and probably should be
scheduled.

826
00:46:05,760 --> 00:46:07,760
But schedule 1 means it can't be
researched.

827
00:46:07,760 --> 00:46:11,040
And when I, I don't agree with
that, but it's a hot topic right

828
00:46:11,040 --> 00:46:13,640
now because the FDA just came
out and they're going to

829
00:46:13,640 --> 00:46:16,240
recommend the DEA schedules in a
schedule 1.

830
00:46:16,600 --> 00:46:20,240
And it's bringing a lot of
awareness that 70 H and kratom

831
00:46:20,240 --> 00:46:23,000
are not the same thing.
And you and I as advocates, I

832
00:46:23,000 --> 00:46:25,920
feel like all I do these days on
social media is try to explain

833
00:46:25,920 --> 00:46:29,120
the difference because people
think they're all the same.

834
00:46:29,280 --> 00:46:31,760
And it used to be we're trying
to explain the difference

835
00:46:31,760 --> 00:46:34,960
between powder and extracts and
we don't let nobody talks about

836
00:46:34,960 --> 00:46:38,160
extracts anymore.
Is Craten powder is 7 OH and

837
00:46:38,160 --> 00:46:41,400
seven OH is like a semi
synthetic, basically an opioid

838
00:46:41,400 --> 00:46:44,440
according to the researchers.
But it's it's just this really

839
00:46:44,440 --> 00:46:46,040
strong.
I hear it's great for pain

840
00:46:46,040 --> 00:46:48,920
relief, which is awesome.
So it should be research, it

841
00:46:48,920 --> 00:46:50,680
should be studied, it should be
regulated.

842
00:46:50,840 --> 00:46:53,000
But what are your thoughts?
Because this is a hot topic at

843
00:46:53,000 --> 00:46:55,040
the moment.
Oh gosh.

844
00:46:56,640 --> 00:47:02,880
Well, I've never tried it.
I've never tried it everywhere,

845
00:47:04,760 --> 00:47:06,400
but I mean, I've tried the
extract.

846
00:47:07,160 --> 00:47:09,480
I just don't need them.
The leaf does it for me.

847
00:47:10,560 --> 00:47:13,640
It just does it for me.
So and I'm not going to sell,

848
00:47:13,640 --> 00:47:16,240
but I might not ever try it.
I might try it, but I just

849
00:47:16,240 --> 00:47:20,040
haven't yet.
But it's made it definitely

850
00:47:20,120 --> 00:47:27,320
harder for me and my job trying
to protect my leaf because of

851
00:47:27,320 --> 00:47:32,600
the advertising from it, the way
it's been pushed out, the

852
00:47:32,600 --> 00:47:36,520
potency of it.
And I have seen people, you

853
00:47:36,520 --> 00:47:38,680
know, that's buying so much of
it.

854
00:47:38,680 --> 00:47:42,760
And that's what's scary to me,
that it is addictive that people

855
00:47:42,760 --> 00:47:45,240
would buy so much of it like
they do.

856
00:47:45,240 --> 00:47:49,000
And but anyway, that's not my
business.

857
00:47:49,520 --> 00:47:54,680
But I do want it.
I don't want it scheduled

858
00:47:54,680 --> 00:47:58,240
because I mean, if it's helping
people, absolutely, you know,

859
00:47:58,240 --> 00:48:01,760
let them have you know what's
helping them and and I do want

860
00:48:01,760 --> 00:48:04,360
it studied more.
You know, just like kratom.

861
00:48:04,360 --> 00:48:06,840
I wanted it studied.
We didn't want it scheduled, but

862
00:48:06,840 --> 00:48:08,560
it does need to be under
control.

863
00:48:09,200 --> 00:48:11,520
I don't think it should be in
the gas station.

864
00:48:12,120 --> 00:48:14,480
I don't think kratom should even
be in a gas station.

865
00:48:14,800 --> 00:48:17,320
To tell the truth.
I would never buy kratom out of

866
00:48:17,320 --> 00:48:21,760
a gas station.
If they wanted that bad, go to a

867
00:48:21,800 --> 00:48:26,240
herbalist ordered offline.
The the reason it's brought so

868
00:48:26,240 --> 00:48:30,280
much attention to you 7 HO
people because it's in the gas

869
00:48:30,280 --> 00:48:35,040
station and it's and it's
advertised like it's a Percocet

870
00:48:35,040 --> 00:48:38,520
or hydrocodones and stuff.
I mean y'all advertising it to

871
00:48:38,520 --> 00:48:40,960
cause attention.
I actually thought the

872
00:48:40,960 --> 00:48:43,600
government, it was a big
government thing doing it

873
00:48:43,880 --> 00:48:46,200
because it came out so big so
fast.

874
00:48:46,200 --> 00:48:50,480
And I'm still not not certain
that it wasn't because that

875
00:48:50,480 --> 00:48:54,160
stuff come out two years and for
it to get so big so fast,

876
00:48:54,760 --> 00:48:58,360
somebody was really pushing it.
But anyway, whoever did it,

877
00:48:58,360 --> 00:48:59,680
they've already made their
billions.

878
00:48:59,680 --> 00:49:02,200
They can go retire now, but
we've got a miss on our hands to

879
00:49:02,200 --> 00:49:06,200
clean up after it.
So I don't want it scheduled.

880
00:49:06,200 --> 00:49:10,080
I do want it regulated and I do
want it out gas stations.

881
00:49:10,920 --> 00:49:12,400
I won't credit about gas
stations though.

882
00:49:13,000 --> 00:49:16,120
So but in Mississippi, that's
what we did.

883
00:49:16,920 --> 00:49:19,520
I don't think the anything
that's not disappear credit.

884
00:49:19,520 --> 00:49:22,520
It cannot be in the gas stations
anymore.

885
00:49:22,520 --> 00:49:25,400
So that the seven HO was going
anyway out of Mississippi.

886
00:49:26,400 --> 00:49:28,560
It's already gone.
They already took it off the

887
00:49:28,560 --> 00:49:29,680
ship.
So it's supposed to be.

888
00:49:30,200 --> 00:49:34,640
And I mean, it's just made our
fight that much harder when all

889
00:49:34,640 --> 00:49:36,720
that came out the past two
years.

890
00:49:36,720 --> 00:49:39,880
But teach your own.
I mean, like I said, I might if

891
00:49:40,240 --> 00:49:43,320
it gets studied and I see that
it's good, it might help me.

892
00:49:44,120 --> 00:49:46,600
Right I.
Might want to take.

893
00:49:46,760 --> 00:49:49,400
I might want to take.
More you know exactly, but

894
00:49:49,400 --> 00:49:52,800
calling them drug names like
Roxy.

895
00:49:53,120 --> 00:49:55,840
Right.
What was a high hydra like they

896
00:49:55,920 --> 00:49:57,800
have?
All these blood names, I just

897
00:49:57,800 --> 00:50:00,960
this my mind is blown after I
really started looking like wow.

898
00:50:01,400 --> 00:50:03,720
And that's the gas station
heroin they're talking about.

899
00:50:03,760 --> 00:50:07,600
It's never been the kratom, but
it just made it made my job a

900
00:50:07,600 --> 00:50:10,480
lot worse.
It's the marketing of it.

901
00:50:11,160 --> 00:50:14,360
Yeah, It really shows that those
manufacturers were extremely

902
00:50:14,360 --> 00:50:16,960
greedy.
They knew how they were going to

903
00:50:16,960 --> 00:50:20,040
market it and market it so
inappropriately.

904
00:50:20,240 --> 00:50:21,800
It should not be in gas
stations.

905
00:50:21,800 --> 00:50:25,440
It should not have drug names.
They should have just done

906
00:50:25,440 --> 00:50:27,360
things right.
So people need to point the

907
00:50:27,400 --> 00:50:29,240
fingers.
The people in the Seven O

908
00:50:29,240 --> 00:50:31,400
community that are upset about
this need to point the fingers

909
00:50:31,400 --> 00:50:34,680
at those manufacturers.
They're the ones that did this.

910
00:50:34,680 --> 00:50:35,960
They're the ones that they could
have.

911
00:50:36,040 --> 00:50:38,040
They could have done this a much
better way.

912
00:50:38,600 --> 00:50:42,240
Should never have called it
kratom and get and have smoke

913
00:50:42,240 --> 00:50:44,600
shops giving out free samples.
You know how many people have

914
00:50:44,720 --> 00:50:47,120
not two, I'm sure you have two.
That said, and I'll start with a

915
00:50:47,120 --> 00:50:49,280
free sample.
They gave me the smoke shop and

916
00:50:49,280 --> 00:50:52,240
telling me it was just kratom.
A lot of these people said they

917
00:50:52,240 --> 00:50:54,320
were very familiar with kratom.
They'd already used powder

918
00:50:54,320 --> 00:50:57,280
kratom and they just thought,
OK, yeah, they it's just a

919
00:50:57,280 --> 00:51:00,720
little bit more of a stronger
kratom and it's the marketing

920
00:51:00,720 --> 00:51:03,880
was done so inappropriately.
They could have avoided all

921
00:51:03,880 --> 00:51:06,200
this, but it just seemed like
they were just doing a big money

922
00:51:06,200 --> 00:51:10,480
grab at the expense of people's
lives.

923
00:51:11,200 --> 00:51:12,920
Yeah, that made my job a lot
harder.

924
00:51:12,920 --> 00:51:15,800
It was it was bad enough when
the extracts started coming out

925
00:51:15,800 --> 00:51:23,280
and feel free that it's not
great but anyway, that's what I

926
00:51:23,280 --> 00:51:27,760
thought yeah and yeah that's
what I thought 7 HO people that

927
00:51:27,760 --> 00:51:30,320
we didn't do that.
Y'all did that every, everybody

928
00:51:30,320 --> 00:51:33,360
this on you and your and your
people that put it out like

929
00:51:33,360 --> 00:51:36,560
that, which like I said, it came
out too big too quick.

930
00:51:36,560 --> 00:51:40,440
And if it goes belly up, I mean
whoever they made their money,

931
00:51:40,680 --> 00:51:41,960
whoever did that they made their
money.

932
00:51:42,080 --> 00:51:43,240
They're not they're not worried
about us.

933
00:51:43,680 --> 00:51:45,000
They're not worried about what
they weren't.

934
00:51:45,160 --> 00:51:48,120
They made their money.
Yeah, they made their money and

935
00:51:48,120 --> 00:51:50,040
they're going to keep making
their money because I'm sure

936
00:51:50,040 --> 00:51:52,160
it'll be a while before it gets
taken off the market.

937
00:51:52,160 --> 00:51:57,120
If if it gets to that, you know,
for any the Pro 70 community

938
00:51:57,120 --> 00:52:00,040
members, if they're listening to
this, can I navigate?

939
00:52:00,160 --> 00:52:01,880
We've been saying that all along
to them.

940
00:52:02,360 --> 00:52:06,360
It's like you'll see us
advocate, we go to our state

941
00:52:06,360 --> 00:52:10,360
capitals, we go to DC, we talk
to people, we share our

942
00:52:10,360 --> 00:52:13,000
experience.
Why don't they do that?

943
00:52:13,000 --> 00:52:16,120
They they don't show their faces
at any of these hearings.

944
00:52:16,120 --> 00:52:17,640
They don't go and talk to
people.

945
00:52:17,960 --> 00:52:22,480
Now with this threat, I hope
this is getting them pumped up

946
00:52:22,480 --> 00:52:25,440
about starting to advocate.
But you know they need instead

947
00:52:25,440 --> 00:52:29,480
of finger pointing, start making
phone calls, make videos and go

948
00:52:29,480 --> 00:52:32,040
do something about it.
Put your energy into that and.

949
00:52:32,040 --> 00:52:35,400
Your science out there, Yeah,
but your science out there.

950
00:52:35,720 --> 00:52:38,960
But yeah, the hundreds of 80s
and it's been hundreds over all

951
00:52:38,960 --> 00:52:43,000
these years.
I've never seen one there for

952
00:52:43,000 --> 00:52:46,200
the extracts or the 708.
I've not.

953
00:52:46,200 --> 00:52:50,520
I've been at the Capitol so many
times, I've never seen one.

954
00:52:51,280 --> 00:52:53,680
Not one.
We've had press conferences for

955
00:52:53,680 --> 00:52:56,200
our credit.
I've never seen one, Not one

956
00:52:56,200 --> 00:53:01,520
sign 708, not single one.
That's your time to shine if

957
00:53:01,520 --> 00:53:04,320
y'all really want to save it
because I mean, I know a lolly

958
00:53:04,320 --> 00:53:06,280
y'all love it.
And I've got to say I'm not

959
00:53:06,280 --> 00:53:09,040
trying to be ugly or anything,
but y'all better stand up and

960
00:53:09,040 --> 00:53:13,960
save your stuff because their
business take it and and it will

961
00:53:13,960 --> 00:53:16,200
be really sad if they schedule
that.

962
00:53:16,200 --> 00:53:18,680
And it can't be if it's
something truly good.

963
00:53:19,080 --> 00:53:21,720
It's everybody saying it is.
I mean to sell that many of it

964
00:53:21,720 --> 00:53:25,600
something going on with it.
But when they get studies out, I

965
00:53:25,600 --> 00:53:28,080
might try it if it's if it's
good.

966
00:53:28,080 --> 00:53:30,280
But I sort of had pool shock in
it.

967
00:53:30,280 --> 00:53:32,520
That's what scared me.
Right, right.

968
00:53:32,520 --> 00:53:34,440
I'm.
Thinking that's what they may

969
00:53:34,440 --> 00:53:37,080
crack with back in the day,
wouldn't and stuff like that.

970
00:53:38,160 --> 00:53:39,600
I don't know.
Exactly.

971
00:53:39,720 --> 00:53:41,760
But you know, leaf powder works
so great for me.

972
00:53:41,760 --> 00:53:45,520
You said it does for use.
It's like I have no desire to go

973
00:53:45,520 --> 00:53:47,760
take anything else.
But if there came a day where

974
00:53:47,800 --> 00:53:50,840
powder just wasn't working
anymore, then yeah, I probably

975
00:53:50,840 --> 00:53:54,120
would try it and use it
responsibly like I did with my

976
00:53:54,120 --> 00:53:57,280
opiates and pain management.
I never overused them.

977
00:53:57,280 --> 00:54:01,440
I always, you know, took what I
needed and, and did it, did it

978
00:54:01,440 --> 00:54:04,880
the right way.
Sherry, this is such a great

979
00:54:04,880 --> 00:54:06,240
conversation.
I feel like we could talk all

980
00:54:06,240 --> 00:54:08,040
day because there's just so much
to talk about.

981
00:54:08,520 --> 00:54:10,520
But we'll wrap up with, you
know, knowing everything you

982
00:54:10,520 --> 00:54:12,200
know now about kratom.
You know, a lot.

983
00:54:12,200 --> 00:54:14,960
You, you, you've been consuming
it for seven years, almost eight

984
00:54:14,960 --> 00:54:16,760
years now.
What advice would you give to

985
00:54:16,760 --> 00:54:19,920
someone who's just starting in
their own kratom journey just to

986
00:54:19,920 --> 00:54:33,080
help them along?
Well, just like from me, when

987
00:54:33,080 --> 00:54:35,400
you start, when you buy, buy
samples.

988
00:54:36,000 --> 00:54:38,520
Don't just buy a whole bunch at
one time.

989
00:54:39,280 --> 00:54:43,040
Buy a few samples like me.
Everybody loves the greens.

990
00:54:43,280 --> 00:54:46,520
Grains put me to sleep.
I cannot take a grain.

991
00:54:47,080 --> 00:54:49,040
I cannot.
Everybody's like these grains

992
00:54:49,040 --> 00:54:50,480
are so good and I want that
grade.

993
00:54:50,480 --> 00:54:53,320
I want it nothing to me that I
cannot take a green.

994
00:54:53,880 --> 00:54:58,440
But red, yellows, I can take
gold.

995
00:54:59,400 --> 00:55:03,120
The white makes me too jittery.
You know, I could take a little

996
00:55:03,120 --> 00:55:07,320
bit of that with the red.
But but yeah, buy samples about

997
00:55:07,320 --> 00:55:12,440
just a little bit to say that
what's going to help you start

998
00:55:12,440 --> 00:55:18,480
out slow.
Don't don't just take a whole

999
00:55:18,600 --> 00:55:22,880
tablespoon.
Take a half a teaspoon or a

1000
00:55:22,880 --> 00:55:27,080
teaspoon if he doesn't.
If it's not helping, about 30

1001
00:55:27,080 --> 00:55:29,680
minutes later, take another half
a teaspoon.

1002
00:55:30,240 --> 00:55:33,320
Do that every 30 minutes until
you do feel like your pains

1003
00:55:33,320 --> 00:55:38,360
getting relate.
And then the next time you you

1004
00:55:38,360 --> 00:55:44,800
dose, add up how many teaspoons
it took to get you to your pain

1005
00:55:44,800 --> 00:55:48,400
level controlled.
And that's what you take for

1006
00:55:48,400 --> 00:55:50,560
your next dose.
Like if it took you up to 2

1007
00:55:50,560 --> 00:55:55,160
teaspoons, that next time you
take that full 2 teaspoons.

1008
00:55:55,800 --> 00:55:58,800
And yeah, that's how I that's
how I did.

1009
00:55:58,800 --> 00:56:01,360
That's how I did mine to get to
my dad's.

1010
00:56:01,400 --> 00:56:04,800
I hope that makes sense, but.
Yeah, low and slow.

1011
00:56:04,800 --> 00:56:06,400
That's what we always think low
and slow.

1012
00:56:06,400 --> 00:56:09,040
Take your time and keep a
journal because that'll help you

1013
00:56:09,080 --> 00:56:12,520
as you figure out your dosing.
Yeah, I would go back and I and

1014
00:56:12,520 --> 00:56:19,400
I bought for different vendors
because it helps me rotate.

1015
00:56:20,200 --> 00:56:24,680
I've got like 3 reputable
vendors that I'll buy from and

1016
00:56:24,680 --> 00:56:28,320
I'll take their stuff one day,
their stuff one day and another.

1017
00:56:28,400 --> 00:56:31,600
I do the same.
I rotate every every dose I

1018
00:56:31,600 --> 00:56:33,680
rotate.
I don't take the like I'll take

1019
00:56:34,960 --> 00:56:37,880
you know, one that one and the
next dose I'll take somebody

1020
00:56:37,880 --> 00:56:40,160
else's.
And I never take the same dose

1021
00:56:40,160 --> 00:56:46,360
at the same time because I do
build up the power if I do take

1022
00:56:46,360 --> 00:56:50,000
breaks, which I rarely do
because my credum just helps me.

1023
00:56:50,000 --> 00:56:53,360
But sometimes I'll just want to
take a break to kind of do a

1024
00:56:53,360 --> 00:56:57,920
reset and I don't have
withdrawals.

1025
00:56:58,240 --> 00:57:01,160
The only thing it does with me
at the end of the night, I may

1026
00:57:01,160 --> 00:57:06,360
have a restless legs, my legs,
they get a little restless and

1027
00:57:06,360 --> 00:57:09,760
I'll get up and I'll take just
1/4 of a teaspoon and my

1028
00:57:09,760 --> 00:57:13,160
restless legs are gone away.
And that way I could go on and

1029
00:57:13,160 --> 00:57:17,760
do my reset, you know, and, and
then by day 2, day three,

1030
00:57:17,760 --> 00:57:20,760
whenever I decide to go back to
my grade, I'm, I'm good and it

1031
00:57:20,760 --> 00:57:23,040
helps so much more.
It's a lot better.

1032
00:57:23,320 --> 00:57:26,760
But that's how I do my resets
so.

1033
00:57:29,040 --> 00:57:31,440
It's all great advice.
Thank you so much for sharing

1034
00:57:31,440 --> 00:57:32,880
all this.
I'm so glad you came on the

1035
00:57:32,880 --> 00:57:34,400
podcast.
This has been really helpful.

1036
00:57:34,400 --> 00:57:36,840
I know people definitely got a
lot, a lot out of this

1037
00:57:37,160 --> 00:57:39,240
conversation with you.
I hope so.

1038
00:57:39,360 --> 00:57:41,600
I don't.
I feel like I'm, I don't know.

1039
00:57:41,960 --> 00:57:45,360
I'm trying to think of anything
else that would help.

1040
00:57:45,720 --> 00:57:50,160
Just don't just yeah, you're
going to hear this so much.

1041
00:57:50,160 --> 00:57:52,520
And I, I couldn't get it at
first because I was trying to

1042
00:57:52,520 --> 00:57:56,760
take more, you know, and you
kind of throw it up.

1043
00:57:56,760 --> 00:57:59,880
For one thing, if you take,
you're going to throw it up, but

1044
00:58:00,240 --> 00:58:05,960
less, less is more.
The less you take, the better.

1045
00:58:05,960 --> 00:58:08,600
It helps.
Instead, if you take, if you

1046
00:58:08,600 --> 00:58:11,760
take like a whole bunch of it at
one time, it's just not going to

1047
00:58:11,760 --> 00:58:12,720
help.
It's going to make you more

1048
00:58:12,720 --> 00:58:17,600
sleepy then, you know, help you
more me more brighter and

1049
00:58:17,600 --> 00:58:19,520
functioning.
You know, it, it, it, it'll

1050
00:58:19,520 --> 00:58:21,320
knock you out.
It's what I'm trying to say.

1051
00:58:21,880 --> 00:58:24,080
If you want to be able to
function through your day, just

1052
00:58:24,080 --> 00:58:26,920
take a little bit of it.
It'll help your pain and you

1053
00:58:26,920 --> 00:58:30,400
could still be able to motivate,
yeah.

1054
00:58:31,960 --> 00:58:33,520
Well said.
Love it.

1055
00:58:33,880 --> 00:58:35,840
Thank you so much for spending
time with us, Sherry.